Could more adequate signage be placed near, entering and around the project? I had a near miss with a pickup truck as I was navigating the road heading east. The truck in question was navigating via gps and heading in the wrong direction assuming incorrectly the pylons were simple roadworks.
This is dangerous as it is. It could be easily fixed with mini-roundabouts (many countries in Europe have used them for decades). This one way system is confusing for people who know the area let alone for tourists or people from out of town. More signage expressly stating WRONG WAY and ONE WAY ONLY in addition to low level directional arrows ( the one on the road are terrible and not very clear). The people who put them on the road might think it is clear but it is a nightmare. My suggestion is to drive through it using the aids given to you alone. I wish you luck not getting into an accident.
Thanks for your feedback. We have taken a look at the signage and, for the purposes of this pilot project, we won't be making any changes at his time. If this project does become permanent than the issue of GPS navigation will be corrected and locals will learn the correct route.
Mini-roundabouts were considered for this location but we felt that the pilot we implemented would be more likely to be successful in the long run than mini-roundabouts.
So, I'm going up Temperance St. heading for Quidi Vidi road. I go this way everyday, and everyday, I see cars turn right as though they were going to Signal Hill, but turn at the base of the hill (left), making the triangle of pylons to the left of the driver, I head to Quidi Vidi road with the triangle of pylons to my right, ultimately the way it was always done. Am I wrong? The cars that turn at the base of the hill look very awkward, and there isn't much room, so I can't imagine that is the correct way to enter Quidi Vidi road. I do the route twice a day to and from work, and I've seen enough cars do this to question who is in the right. Also, I can clearly see the stop line on Duckworth on top of Temperance, I have yet to see a car stop there...can I assume Temperance St traffic have the right of way there? My other comment is regarding tour buses. On the very first day of this, I witnessed a giant tour bus trying to make a right turn to Temperance from Duckworth. Obviously, this is an easier left turn. Considering the amount of tour buses from the cruise ships and such, I would think this would be a problem more closely addressed.
I agree in it's original form, that this intersection was confusing. But only due to one stop, that being the stop sign at the corner of Duckworth and Temperance. The 3-way stop at the bottom of Signal Hill seemed to be fine, unless there was a car stopped at that corner stop sign. My understanding, was that because that was a stop sign, the car was to stop for traffic going to and from Temperance. Another big traffic obstruction was parking in front of the new coffee shop. The parked cars completely blocked the views of drivers on Battery Road, and Temperance St.( so seeing a pedestrian was out of the question too) and look at the map and see how far back the stop line is for Battery Road. How on earth are drivers suppose to see anything. I tried the Cooks Hill once...only once, as I nearly had the front of my car taken off, that lane and the street are on very different elevations.
Now, except for this summer during construction, I've never had to wait very long to get through that intersection, now, I do. Today, only 2 cars ahead of me both running the stop line, on Duckworth, then stopping just before the pylons cause they didn't seem to know where to go. If this is going to be a concept you adapt on a permanent basis, there will have to be a lot more than signage going up, you will have to make those pylon islands into concrete ones. I strongly disagree on making this a seasonal adjustment. People complained it was confusing enough without having it change with the seasons!! You just can't do that to people. But imagine the snow on those concrete islands...again, visibility. I know one voice isn't going to change or make anyone's mind up. But some of the issues I've mentioned are valid. And right now, motorists are so confused by the sight of all those orange pylons (looking more like a construction zone) they are slowing down because they don't know where to go, so of course, it's going to look safer and like a success. I watched your video many times. My questions were not answered. Perhaps an animation like the ones done for roundabouts would have been more helpful.
You are following the correct path from Temperance to Quidi Vidi Road. If this pilot becomes a permanent installation we will look at ways to make this pattern more clear and consistent.
Compliance with the stop sign on Duckworth Street at Temperance has been an issue for many years. As part of this work we upgraded the sign but are still having trouble with compliance. Improving the interaction between Duckworth and Temperance even further is something that will inform any permanent design.
On the first day of installation the full pilot project was not complete and the intersection control was not as it now is. There were a lot of tour buses that day with a large cruise ship in town and accommodations were made to facilitate them. Tour bus operators now know to select an alternate route.
It is not the intention of the City to have this become a seasonal change.
The pylons do look a lot like a construction zone. Unfortunately that is the nature of a trial project like this. We try to get as close as we can to the concept at a minimum cost. If Council chooses to move ahead with this project the retrofit would be completed with new concrete curbs and permanent signs.
When are you going to close off garrison hill from military road, one of the most dangerous and stupid intersections in the city. How many pedestrians are going to get hurt before you close off the road from military Rd?
Thank you for the feedback. This area is not part of our set of pilot projects but we will look into your concern.
I was looking for the project for Kings Bridge Road. Will there be an opportunity to give feedback for the changes there?
A project page for the Winter Avenue restriction is now available here: http://www.engagestjohns.ca/winter-avenue
Please provide your feedback on that project via the Q&A available there and stay tuned for a public survey later on in the trial.
Just popping in to add my support to the two comments regarding the addition of biking lanes. It's time for St. John's to start thinking and planning ahead to create a safer environment for cyclists and automobiles on our city streets. I get that this is simply a temporary plan or a trial run, but I sure hope the cyclists will actually be considered into any final plans. It's a small step, but an important one that could lead better traffic flow in other parts of the city at a later date.
Thank you for your feedback! Much appreciated.
Hello, this looks like a great plan and a good idea except I am very disappointed to see no mention of bikes, or bike lanes. I commute through this area almost every day on my bike and on recreational rides will go into the battery or up Signal Hill. Converting from 2-way to one-way traffic provides a perfect opportunity for some nice wide bike lanes. Even just this morning... I had to yell at a driver who passed by me with just inches to spare. When will City Hall start considering biking infrastructure rather than talking about it in their 'plan'. Start taking some simple actions!
A pilot project such as this acts as a "proof of concept" for the fundamental changes involved. It does not consider many other aspects that a permanent installation would include such as sidewalks, cycling facilities, on street parking, and curb location. These would all be considered as part of the ultimate design if this project is successful and approved by Council for permanent installation.
If this change becomes permanent next year, will bike lanes be incorporated into the new street design?
If this project is successful and approved by Council for permanent installation then cycling facilities will be considered as part of the ultimate design. The final decision on whether or not to include cycling facilities will depend upon several factors that have not yet been explored.